Battery drain issues #18
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Just an idea: I think it might not be necessary to keep all data of heartrate a.s.o. (?) What about keeping only, let's say, every tenth of it and do excessive data collecting only about half an hour (at least the smart wakeup time) before the wake up alarm? Some "smart" logic on detecting movements could maybe help too, e.g. only submit it, if it is a xy% higher value than the one before. If an value was detected, which meets this "treshold", there could start a excessive collecting for 30secs or so... Keyword: respect smart wakeup |
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Is it possible to run stuff as a callback on the watch's motion detection rather than running on a timer? Garmin do their own sleep detection which I assume uses this type of thing. I guess the question is whether the public API allows for this level of integration. I reckon about 20% average usage per night on my Fenix 5HR. I'd be happier if it were closer to 10%. It's still a world apart from the Samsung watch usage. :-). |
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@MrFly Sorry not sure what you mean by a.s.o.? @ronnyadsetts |
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@Artaud a.s.o. = and so on :-) Good idea, if it does not harm (because of the low available memory on the watches) |
I would imagine that v1 of the API needs to be supported by SaA for a good while yet (I am obviously biased here) and using the newer callback API looks like it would pretty much double the work for maintaining the App. That said, it does seem that it may be a direction to explore at some point. |
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How big drain do you get on your watch model? How big a drain is acceptable for you? What might be the causes of the drain? What might be done to lower it? As a long time Beta user of SaA I came here to provide my experience so far since moving from an Amazfit to Garmin VivoActive3 Music (Thanks Jiri for pointing me here to post this). When I first saw how much battery drain occured overnight I nearly sent the watch straight back to Amazon! Comparing this against the drain of an amazfit just seems bonkers! Heck I even contemplated sending it back and paying the extra for a Fenix 5Plus (any excuse right?) but from experimenting and seeing that on it's own the Garmin uses very little power over night I think from my point of view interfacing with Garmin makes more sense? |
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@unseenuk Garmin is not doing the same thing with sleep tracking as we are. They are collecting all the sleep data on the watch and only sync a few times per day. We are syncing almost realtime (usually every two minutes we send a batch of sensor data), so a big part of the battery drain is not actually querying the accelerometer, but bluetooth communication. (Also, Garmin wants $5000 upfront to get access to their web APIs) |
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@Artaud Please note I'm not even a beginner programmer here so this is just a question, is there another way to access the bluetooth? Or maybe streamlining the data that is being sent to cut the usage? I ask as when I used the watch without SaA with all notifications allowed one night (I get text/whatsapp alerts through the night from servers) it used only 2-3% and yes it did wake me a number of times with the notifications. Last night I ran with SaA and it used 25% battery so the drain seems at least consistent, this was even with all notifications stopped from being sent. For sake of argument I will try tonight without SaA but leave notifications enabled, I expect a 2-3% drop. |
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How big drain do you get on your watch model? How big a drain is acceptable for you? What might be the causes of the drain? What might be done to lower it? |
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On my Garmin Forerunner 645 Music battery is entierly drained during longer nights. During shorter ones I loose like 70-90% or so. Acceptable to me would be not more than 50%. I noticed my display lits up several times when I try to go to sleep. If this happens throughout the night it is definitely one source for all the battery drain. If this some kind of automatic backlight that is not at all usable with my clock since it doesn't need backlight very often. I also tried with and without the setting HR monitoring in the app but it seems to record my HR regardless. If this uses ANT+ that is also known to utilize pretty much battery for my clock. |
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I'm also noticing very large battery drain with my Forerunner 645 (regular). For a while it was only draining ~10-20% which was fine. I could go about 3-4 days without charging. Now I go to bed with the watch >90% and wake up and it's consistently around 30%. Something is up. |
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...as a follow up to my ForeRunner 645 Music issues: I found that starting the sleep monitoring though the phone pulls up a menu "Start sleep monitoring: Yes-No" on my watch. If answering "Yes" the behavior explained above applies. As an alternative I have tried to use the "No" (or back button) on my watch. Next thing I manually start the sleep monitoring trough the activities widget installed. This makes the battery usage 30-50% during a night. This battery usage is even acceptable, even tough optimizations (including fixing the above behavior when using the "Yes" alternative) would always be welcome. =) |
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I can confirm the same as @fgunger. Starting from the watch manually does NOT drain the battery whereas clicking "yes" on the watch when starting from the phone causes the drain. |
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Thanks everyone for your reports. I've received a strange report (not sure if it applies to every watch) that the drain is also linked to setting "Smart HR" measurement in your watch settings. |
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Just jumping in to (mostly) confirm what has been said before. I've done a couple tests on a FR645 Music, which lead to the following battery drains on the watch :
The relative uncertainty on those values is large because my tests were not done on full nights (just came across this post only today) but rather done on 0.5-1.5h intervals while simply wearing the watch (so battery drain could be less if I'm sleeping, I haven't looked at how the code buffers info sent to the phone). I've stopped there in my tests because IMO 4%/h (i.e. 32% for a whole 8h night) is rather acceptable. Forces me to charge my FR every morning before I workout but it's at most a nuisance, doesn't prevent me from using SaA. Otherwise, there is no "Smart HR" setting that I can find in the 645's menu. edit : I might add that this battery drain does not surprise me at all from the 645, having lost some long rides in the past because the battery had died - which is precisly one of the negative points that's noted again and again in this watch's reviews |
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Hi @Artaud, I'm using the Forerunner 935 for sleep tracking. For a while the battery drain was rather bad, then with the recent upgrades it got really good (when you reduced the sampling rate). However, Garmin released the 15.10 update for the watch a few days ago and the sleep tracking absolutely kills the battery now. For reference, I lost about 20% per night before you reduced the sampling rate, 10% after, and now it's up to around 40% for an 8 hour sleep tracking. Not sure what the underlying issue is, but there's this relevant looking ChangeLog entry:
See the relevant garmin forum topic: https://forums.garmin.com/sports-fitness/running-multisport/f/forerunner-935/210297/forerunner-935-sw-15-10-is-live I asked in the topic and others (probably without the Sleep As Android app on the watch) don't experience big battery drains, and it doesn't happen during the day either (I checked), so it's most probably this app. I even did a full factory reset to eliminate possible upgrade problems. Please look into it, because the watch suddenly went from needing to charge it once a week to once every 2 days. :( Let me know if I should open a separate issue for this. |
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Garmin Vivoactive 4S, just woke up to a dead (10%) watch, started tracking at 80% the night before. Would gladly help with any troubleshooting, Garmin's sleep tracking is atrocious, but Sleep as Android works great. edit: HR enabled, Pulse Ox disabled, Garmin's sleep (activity) tracking also enabled |
Hi @Artaud, I'd like to confirm everything in @adarazs post. I'm also using the Forerunner 935 and as soon as I updated to 15.10, the battery drains dramatically after each sleep tracking session. I basically need to charge the watch every morning now. Thanks. |
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I think I found a workaround for this new battery drain. So I always start tracking from my phone, which then pops up a confirmation on the watch "Launch Sleep?" with a Yes/No option, which I accept by selecting Yes. However, for two nights I went into the activity list on my watch and launched the "Sleep" app directly aaand... voila, those nights I only lost 5% battery. The third night I tried to launch it the usual way and I was back to 40% drain over the night. Today I tried again to start it from the watch and I lost 5% again, so it seems there's something about the phone side "Garmin add-on" app that bombards the watch with requests and drains the battery. tl;dr: Try starting the Sleep app directly on the watch. @tmladek, @tof9 let me know if this method works for you too. The total lack of reaction from the SaA crew to this big issue for a month makes me weary to rely on the program/Garmin support long term, but at least now I can use my watch normally again. I also submitted a bug report about this through the app 3.5 weeks ago to which I got no answer either. The lack of reactions are definitely discouraging, especially that this is a paid and non-open source app (I mean the Android app.) |
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@adarazs Lots of thanks for finding out about this. I'm sorry I did not get back to this earlier, however just yesterday I was doing a big refactor of the phone-side addon and did some optimizations regarding exactly this - the number of requests that are sent to the watch. I'm now testing it and may release the new version as soon as today if it goes well. |
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I can confirm that I have been doing a similar test with my Vivoactive 3m.
If I do it from the watch I only lose about 10-15% but as has been seen
from the phone anything from 40% upwards. I have been doing that for a
week or so now and it's been quite consistent with the figures when
activated from the watch.
Rob
…On Wed, 29 Jan 2020, 12:34 Jiří Richter, ***@***.***> wrote:
@adarazs <https://github.com/adarazs> Lots of thanks for finding out
about this. I'm sorry I did not get back to this earlier, however just
yesterday I was doing a big refactor of the phone-side addon and did some
optimizations regarding exactly this - the number of requests that are sent
to the watch. I'm now testing it and may release the new version as soon as
today if it goes well.
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Just tried it with my 4S, went from 88% to 50% (over 8hrs). Better than last time when I woke up to a dead watch starting from a similar charge, I suppose, but unfortunately still too much for me to use daily :(
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Tested the updated version last night using the pop up instead of manually opening sleep. Battery went from 58% to dead. So update did not fix the issue. |
Could you please send a wearable report using Sleep > left menu > send wearable report? Thanks a lot.. |
Done. |
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As to the workaround, what exactly is supposed to be the difference in launching the tracking from the watch or the phone? Starting the activity on my 4S triggers the opening of the SaA app on my phone - and at least visually looks just the same as opening the app and starting the tracking from there - is this not the case for everyone?
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Yes it is the same, except when starting from phone, you get the prompt on the watch asking whether you want to launch Sleep on the watch. Apparently there's an issue with that. I'm going through the log that @FuzzyMistborn sent and hopefully will find the cause. |
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Oh I can't actually find the log from @FuzzyMistborn - could you please write me a line at [email protected] so I know from which email did you send the log? |
Done. |
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I have a Vivoactive 4S and I have the battery drain issue even if I start it from the watch. |
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Sorry - seems I had a NPE in there, causing the app to not track properly and being unable to send logs. We're rolling it out now on Play Store but just as a 10% rollout so you might have to wait if you want it through Play Store. |
Does this mean the drain should be fixed in this version, or just the logging? And since I also have a 4S and still get huge battery drain even with the "workaround", just like @jateitel, should I also try to send a report with the new version? |
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I haven't tried the workaround but unfortunately at the moment sleep tracking with my Vivoactive 4s is not usable or at least very uncomfortable because of the battery drain. When almost full it's at 10% after ~8 hours of tracking. Let me know if I can help anyhow to get rid of that bug. I tried tracking with sonar but then my recordings are ruined by the chirp sound. So I would like to use my watch. Edit: Starting from the watch doesn't drain as much as starting from the smartphone. I also found out that during tracking the display lights on my watch go on even when DND is on and the watch is locked. |
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I get a drain of 60 % overnight or about 7 %/hr on Forerunner 245. 1-2 %/hr would be nice. I've tried
All with the same battery drain. This morning I also couldn't turn off watch vibration alarm before or after completing phone captcha, and the Bluetooth had turned itself off on the phone. Don't know if that's connected. |
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Hi Jukkyrjo,
Option 3 certainly works for me on a Vivoactive 3 music. I lose on average
about 20% per night but i have noticed that it creeps towards 30% lately so
I'm not sure if the recent tweak to improve things has possibly made that
workaround not as efficient or I'm not noticing the battery level before
turning it on. Will try to record it tonight before and after and see how
it goes.
…On Sat, 7 Mar 2020, 10:26 jukkyrjo, ***@***.***> wrote:
I get a drain of 60 % overnight or about 7 %/hr on Forerunner 245.
1-2 %/hr would be nice.
I've tried
1. Starting sleep tracking on phone app and accepting the notification
on the watch
2. Starting sleep tracking on phone app and declining the notification
on the watch, then starting watch app manually
3. Starting watch app manually without touching phone app (is this the
workaround method some people have working?)
All with the same battery drain.
This morning I also couldn't turn off watch vibration alarm before or
after completing phone captcha, and the Bluetooth had turned itself off on
the phone. Don't know if that's connected.
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I'm still having trouble on my Vivoactive 4S. Even with the latest versions of everything I got 60% drain last night. Is there anything I can do to help? Send logs? Test beta code? Donate money? Sleep tracking is one of the primary reasons I got the Garmin and the build-in one is terrible. Jeff |
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I know this comment won't be particularly helpful but having just upgraded
from a VA3 to a VA4 I was massively disappointed about the battery usage on
the 4 to the point I've now stopped using it. So I'd like to second the
previous poster and say I'm also willing to try a new build if one is
coming soon?
Thanks,
Rob
…On Tue, 28 Apr 2020, 13:38 Jeff Teitel, ***@***.***> wrote:
I'm still having trouble on my Vivoactive 4S. Even with the latest
versions of everything I got 60% drain last night.
Is there anything I can do to help? Send logs? Test beta code? Donate
money? Sleep tracking is one of the primary reasons I got the Garmin and
the build-in one is terrible.
Jeff
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@Artaud Hi, just a follow up: I used the "starting tracking from the watch" workaround until now, which gives me an acceptable ~15%/night drain on the FR935. Though I think that is similar to the 40%/night that others are reporting other watches, as the FR935 has a huge battery with a 14 days battery life when not using SaA. Today I tried again triggering tracking from the phone and clicking "Yes" on the watch for starting sleep and I lost 50% battery overnight. So whatever you tried to fix on the Garmin companion + connect IQ app didn't solve the drain issue. I'm running everything on the latest stable version. |
Hey, I have a Garmin Venu and it's been draining around 40% battery in about eight hours of sleep for several nights now, I've tried both starting it from my phone and from my watch with no apparent differences in battery drain. I also saw that there was a major rewrite of the code around four months ago which I think should be the version I'm using as I downloaded the app from the CIQ store, correct? It says that one of the changes is "batched sensor data", does this refer to not sending data to the phone every two minutes? I'd assume the only thing the phone is needed for is for the smart wake up period, right? Wouldn't it be sufficient to save the sleep data on the watch and only send it close to the smart wakeup period? This is assuming of course that sending the data is causing the battery drain issues. |
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I have some new findings from today. If anyone else wants to try that as well, I would like to see the battery drain on your watches too |
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@mattnoir I think the catch may be the phone fell back to Sonar or accelerometer.. I can tell you whjat happened if you use menu - report a bug and send us the log.. Many thanks.. |
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@petrnalevka I just sent the log. I don't think the phone fell back to sonar or accelerometer as I keep my phone on nightstand next to me. Accelerometer has no effect then, and sonar can't catch it either. Heart rate is showing till 4am, activity log is consistent too. I hope you will be able to find something interesting in the logs. edit: So I checked the logs myself and it seems like garmin was not connected, or at least was not sending data as in previous instance where it was connected the whole night. So it's a little weird thing to see how it seems like sleep received data with heart rate and accelerometer when cellphone was chilling away from reach of its' own accelerometer and sonar as well, as those data and results are really completely different edit2: Okay, change of thoughts. It may be that it managed to receive data from Google Fit. I am just not sure how it managed to do it so soon. I am checking some past graphs, and there is heart rate showing, along some activity as well, even though I had the same settings (using sleep basically just to turn on notifications until battery drain will be resolved). What I don't understand is still higher battery usage than when it's just garmin sleep tracking, or at least I believe it's like that |
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@petrnalevka I was thinking. |
There's not enough runtime memory for a watch app to be able to store that much data before sending. We are actually saving some data and sending it in batches - the data are being gathered from the sensor every 100ms, but sent to the phone every 2 minutes. It's just a lot of data needed for precise movement tracking. |
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Could the data be compressed perhaps? Looks like its being stored and send raw. In simplest approach, suppose we have readings of heart rate as follows: If the data is reduced to sliding moving average window, this could reduce its size dramatically. This sacrifices accuracy of course, but this is something that has to be done to certain degree inevitably it seems. I'm sure there are other algorithms out there that will produce tremendous results (maybe even without accuracy tradeoff) considering the data corpus is very narrow being a small set of integers (and a range of floats in case of accelerometer). Some other data hacks can be done. For instance, most HR readings are probably 50s, we could store those in one byte rather than uint if we substract 50 from them and either add it back before sending or do that on the Android side. The messages are also sent as strings, this must introduce huge overhead and switching to raw data buffers should reduce the time it takes to send them and therefore sync session drain. F245M, roughly 90% per sleep, I'm risking not having an alarm. |
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How big a drain do you get on your watch model? How big a drain is acceptable for you? What might be the causes of the drain? An annoyance I had, which I thought might also contribute in a small way to the battery was the backlight coming on very brightly whenever I moved. e.g. #9 My watch's default setting was 'in activity' to turn the backlight on for 14secs at 50% brightness whilst in activity after sunset, I've now just turned this off so it's button press only. What might be done to lower it?
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How big a drain do you get on your watch model? |
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I also had about 20 to 30 percent battery drain on my Fenix 7 which is too much. I bought this watch because of the long battery life. Yesterday i did take a look at the code and made some changes for myself. I reverted the code back to before the HTTP communication layer was added: 9859c16 I also commented out all the DebugManager.log lines, but I don't know if this made a big difference, but the app is a bit smaller and will use less memory this way. I tested this version of the app last night and had only about 10% battery drain. I guess the HTTP requests generate much more overhead than the Bluetooth packages. I also had no connection issues during the night. Maybe this HTTP feature should be optional via an app setting for watches that have a problem transmitting the Bluetooth packages. |
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This issue is still present. I bought a Fēnix 7s because I wanted a month of battery life, and did sleep tracking last night for the first time. Lost 40% battery overnight. |
Isn't the http layer what made consistent communication possible? I remember it was added to stop missed alarms and inconsistent tracking. |
and others
Let's talk about the battery drain.
How big drain do you get on your watch model?
How big a drain is acceptable for you?
What might be the causes of the drain?
What might be done to lower it?
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